User talk:Project2501a/Archive1

Welcome to the Wikipedia

Welcome, newcomer!

Here are some useful tips to ease you into the Wikipedia experience:

First, take a look at the Wikipedia Tutorial, and perhaps dabble a bit in the test area.
When you have some free time, take a look at the Manual of Style and Policies and Guidelines. They can come in very handy!
Remember to use a neutral point of view!
If you need any help, feel free to post a question at the Help Desk
Explore, be bold in editing pages, and, most importantly, have fun!

Also, here are some odds and ends that I find useful from time to time:

Feel free to ask me anything the links and talk pages don't answer. You can most easily reach me by posting on my talk page.

You can sign your name on any page by typing 4 tildes, likes this: ~~~~.

Best of luck, and have fun!

ClockworkTroll 17:58, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Re: Unexpected Welcome, indeed

Heh - no, no warning from me today. And there's always time for a good Yakov Smirnoff reference!

If you happen to run across a page that needs cleaning up, you have couple of choices:

If your're into that kind of thing, you can learn about the subject and do what you can to make the article better
You can always just leave it - we have thousands of active editors, and somebody's bound to have the knowledge and motivation to do the necessary work.

In the end, however, just try to be bold in updating pages: Wikis develop faster when people fix problems, correct grammar, add facts, make sure the language is precise, and so on.

Good luck!

ClockworkTroll 19:15, 10 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Γεια χαρά

Γεια σου ομοιδεάτη αντικληρικαλιστή... This is the English Wikipedia, so I'm going to write in English from now on; I suggest you do the same. Some of you greek comments such as "Α ρε τραγοπαπάδες" are not very much appreciated, although I'd agree with you in other circumstances. Wikipedia is (well, aims to be) an encyclopedia, and sober, neutral-point-of-view (in the spirit of developing consensus, not imposing) remarks and contributions are the ones most welcome.

Anyway, I'd like to welcome you to Wikipedia myself. I suggest adding yourself to the lists of Greek Wikipedians and Multilingual Wikipedians. Keep in touch. Etz Haim 12:26, 12 Oct 2004 (UTC)

An extra tip: Don't use Greek letters in edit summaries, cause they look like hell in the page history. Etz Haim 16:20, 12 Oct 2004 (UTC)

that's the thing i don't like about Wikis... no UTF-8 support... "[ Project2501a 14:24, 13 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Mikis Theodorakis

I feel that there is a certain bias behind some "quotes" attributed to Theodorakis. Please review. Etz Haim Etz Haim 11:01, 13 Oct 2004 (UTC)

I agree with you in the sense that criticism towards the Israeli government -or any other national government- does not imply any kind of prejudice againsth the Israelis - or any other nation. The sad part is that Theodorakis DID recklessly say much of that BS in his Haaretz interview, creating a disaster for himself. Nevertheless, this section of the article has a certain bias agaist him. I think this heap of "quotes" should be transformed into readable prose, where both Theodorakis' ups (ie. the epic "Mauthausen") and downs (ie. "the root of all evil") are mentioned.

You don't have to do the writing, though. I intent to radically re-write his political history, including the above plus some stuff I've got in my incubator. If you think it would be useful, take a look in the Greek newspapers' archives, and tell me what you find. Etz Haim 14:30, 13 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Έλα ρε Γιώργο. Έπιασες δουλειά, ε; Would you go and talk to Theodorakis himself? This would be great! Make sure to convey to him my deepest respects. A couple of things I want to tell you: a) Keep a close eye on my incubator. b) When you have to choose among different spellings of Greek names in English, you may use GoogleFight to tell you which has the more hits on Google, choose one that fits within your acceptable standards, and then create redirects for the remaining possible (mis)spellings.See? Etz Haim 08:18, 17 Oct 2004 (UTC)

OMHROI.gr

I think it's OK. I'm not the judge of everything but I couldn't help noticing that there are some guys that inflate their user pages with all sorts of stupid stuff such as propaganda material (ie posters) for Bush and Kerry. A little display of non-propagatory political sensitivity (and sanity) wouldn't harm anyone. And your page looks good - from all aspects.

PS. Wish me "chronia polla", 3/11 is my birthday ;) Etz Haim 23:21, 2 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Vassilis Leventis

There's an edit dispute on Vassilis Leventis (not kidding) between User:Quantis and me, which has led into two versions of the article, one his and one mine. Please review them and comment on it. Thank you. Etz Haim 17:38, 13 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Vassilis Leventis:Quantis reply

Until you find proof that you are not an elephant/troll, I will assume you are one. :)

I don't know the term "troll", except if you refer to the mythical creatures.

"didn't changed" ???? wtf?? Who the heck taught you English?

By the way, posting in the English wikipedia requires a good command of the english language. It is clear, judging by your writing style as set forth in the history of the article on Mr. Leventis and in this post, that you do not possess such a command.

For example, you translated the word αποδείξεις (ουσιαστικό) into 'proofs'. In Greek, yes, you use plural to refer to proof. But you cannot simply translate the word proof and concatenate an s. Proofs in English does not refer to the evidence or argument that compels the mind to accept an assertion as true; it reffers to book proofing and original prints of a book. I think you would be better off editing in the Greek wikipedia (http://el.wikipedia.org).

That's not your business. Also you may have to respect others and not insult them, if you don't know them. Writing an article in Wikipedia is entirely different by answering to someones opinion quickly. So, please...

Responsibility of bringing forth proof of a "conspiracy" lies with those that claim said conspiracy exists, not the other way. You are the one accusing the greek media of a conspiracy. What you are doing is crying wolf. You sound like a Christan Right Winger from the US or Christodoulos preaching in Sunday Mass about the evils of homosexuality: Screaming bloody murder and not offering any proof of how you're being put down.

Calm down and give us FACTS and public records. Pointing out the non-existance of something and offering is as proof is a logical fallacy and it is circumstantial evidence at best. Give solid examples, back by dates and your article can be restored. Till then, your article gets an Negative POV from me.

Ok. I challenge you. Find in the mainstream greek public press interviews with representatives from other parties than the first 4-5 in national elections. Until then keep for your self democracy lessons.

What you are implying is that simply because a page has a controversial topic someone has to change it. What you are talking about is retaliation. Etz didn't retaliate against you. He edited an article he thought had a partisan point of view. You changed it back and then you demanded that your point of view is the only one that's true. The way things are done in wikipedia is that an article is posted and people then edit and re-edit and re-edit it, and talk about it and discuss it, till a consensus is developed. Obviously, you're just interesting in hearing only your own point of view.

I would love to hear alternative voices in the Greek media. Nobody's trying to stop you from creating an article about Mr. Leventis. A lot of people, though, are going to prevent you from making an article FOR Mr. Leventis. The point of Wikipedia is that you write your articles using perspective, which you do not exhibit.

Hmmm. Where excactly in my article I wrote something FOR Leventis? Mr. Etz Haim wrote:

Some of his points are simply ridiculus, like "Leventis' typewriter"...

Yes. Mr. Leventis used a typerwriter during the Junta and typed messages of freedom distributing them all over Athens. That's a fact.

"His influence on the Greek society is merely negligible (0,56% of the greek vote countrywide, see the last election results from an official source (http://ekloges.ypes.gr/en/)).

If Mr. Etz Haim wanted to write an article ABOUT Mr. Leventis why he didn't write all elections history of Enosi Kentroon but only the result of the last one? Mr. Leventis 1992 was elected second in the Second Electoral District of Athens after PASOK's candidate mr Mangakis and he received 100.000 and more votes (30%, of the District's population - which is the bigger in Greece). Also, Enosi Kentroon, is the only "small" greek party that its members run offices for it in USA and Germany (not so small now, huh?). A US Senator, mr Feingold and the famous by civil rights campaigns, Jesse Jackson are positive to Enosi Kentroon and Vassilis Leventis struggle for democracy. (so, this party is getting bigger...) You may say WHY I say now all these and I didn't add them in the article first time? Ok. I had not the time to do it. There is any proof for all these? Yes there is. Call mr Feingold and mr Jackson if you have doubts. So. Now, if I even admit that wrote an article FOR mr Leventis, mr Etz Haim wrote an article AGAINST mr Leventis. Why you don't say anything for that?

The article also propagates Leventis' POV that there is a conspiracy by the greek media against him, and these allegations are far from being proved. Etz Haim 05:14, 19 Sep 2004 (UTC)

You are displaying signs of Trolling, a troll with a political agenda. I wouldn't have responded to you inside Etz's talk page, normaly, because ITS BAD PRACTICE TO DO SO, but you went and screwed with my happy birthday wish.

Sorry for screwing your happy birthday wish.

So, this is a warning.

Huh?

Quantis

Leventis again

That was my version of the article you edited, and consequently my English. Honestly, I like it more the way it was before. Etz Haim 16:03, 19 Nov 2004 (UTC)

NJIT

I think the more important question is: why is it relevant? First, the Princeton Review ranking methodology is hardly significant nor useful. Besides, having the list there assumes that people actually understand what "Professors Get Low Marks" or "More to Do On Campus Social" actually means (or that people actually care what they mean). I mean, who cares if NJIT ranks 18th as "Is It Food?" and what does that really mean and who really cares? At the very most, it should be distilled into one or two sentences, pulling out significant points. Darkcore 17:25, 8 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Hanuka alegre

Hanuka alegre a vos tambien (=Happy Hanukkah to you as well), although I'm not Jewish. I'm just culturally interested in Jewish culture and tradition. Anyway, it was very considerate of you to give me your wishes on that occasion, so thank you. :) Etz Haim 22:55, 13 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Greek literature

That would be very nice, but keep a couple of things in mind:

When you translate copyrighted material, you own the copyright of your translated document, put publishing it may infringe the copyright of the author of the original document. You may have to seek permission from the author before starting out.
It's a lot of work to be done, so take your time, keep a reasonable pace and don't burn out in the process!

-- Etz Haim 19:02, 14 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Conscription

For what you said in my talk page, you are 110% right, so I restored the first part of your statement. However, I disagree with the comparison you made between the Greek and the Turkish military. Although the Greek military wants to establish itself politically and takes advantage of the conscripts' misfortune to manipulate situations, the Turkish military is way ahead in its political establishment. Its structures are interweaved into the Turkish state, it has a greater deal of autonomy, and it controls political affairs by constantly threatening to destabilize the country. So there's no need for them to bully conscripts! Etz Haim 15:42, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)

I've never edited the text on Conscription, only rearranged a couple of paragraphs, so this article can't tell much about my English. Etz Haim 02:38, 10 Jan 2005 (UTC)

VfD on Greek Civil War the right wing view

It's on Wikipedia:Votes for deletion. Go there and cast your vote. Etz Haim 18:15, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Newark pics

Recently I and others have been expanding the list of Newark neighborhoods that have articles written about them. So far University Heights, Downtown Newark the Ironbound, Forest Park, Weequahic, Broadway, and Vailsburg have stubs/full fledged articles. Right now, Downtown lacks even a single photo. If you could take a pic of Broad Street you would improve the article greatly.

I feel that the Newark neighborhood articles could be greatly improved by a photograph or two for each. If you spend time in Newark and you have a digital camera, you could help the Brick City out a lot in this way. Personally, I think that the main Newark article is saturated with pictures already. In some places text is obscured. dinopup

Greece

If the anonymous user reverts the article once more, don't revert him yourserlf, report him in WP:VIP instead. Etz Haim 20:15, 3 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Did this myself. Etz Haim 21:13, 3 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Macedonian Slavs

Hi there! If you'd care to comment on the current dispute on Talk:Macedonian Slavs, you being a local and all, you'd be very welcome. -- ChrisO 00:44, 5 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Note to both you and Kapnisma: On the debate on Talk:Macedonian Slavs, Greece's mode of administration (democratic, tolerant or the exact opposite) is not the matter in question. This whole issue has started because we want to check if INTERREG's 100,000 is correctly attributed to the EU, as ChrisO suggests. Your statement's on the Greek state's credibility etc. are both in the realm of political opinion, and are out of the interests of this discussion. Please try to focus on the substance of this. Etz Haim 19:04, 5 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Dully noted. Wilco. Project2501a 23:11, 5 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Apart from the depate about macedonian-slavs, I would like to comment something.I fully respect your opinions (despite the fact that I might disagree in some), nothing pleases me more than to debate with others.But allow me (without any vice and without any intention to be seen as I lecture you) to say that sometimes the way you are writing and you express yourself makes you seen like a fanatic and να χανεις το δικιο σου.

fanatic? nah, i don't think so. Demented? Jury's still out. Opinionated? certainly! :D Project2501a 11:17, 7 Jan 2005 (UTC)

φιλικα ,Kapnisma 06:57, 7 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Katathesame tin pshfo mas ston Papadiamanti. Den eixa idea oti ginontai tetoies pshfofories. Gia o,ti neo enhmerwne na boithame.

Kostasge 09:15, 7 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Polytonic rendering, again

Please read: Talk:Greek language and Template talk:Polytonic. When you want to render polytonic Greek script and polytonic ONLY, use the {{polytonic}} template instead of the {{IPA}}. Etz Haim 23:28, 8 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Eastern Orthodox views on homosexuality

See Talk:Christian views of homosexuality#User:Phiddipus.27 personal essay and add your comments on this edit dispute. Etz Haim 03:01, 12 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Reverting your user page

I've reverted your page, as it looked like an edit was broken. (The database has been messing up, and I've seen multiple articles cut off like this). If this is not correct and the edit was intended as such, do of course revert back. Also, thanks for reporting me for vandalism, I await my just punishment by the cabal. :-) JRM 02:13, 2005 Jan 17 (UTC)

Translating the 2005 Belize unrest

Hi. Etz Haim suggested I contact you. Could you possibly translate 2005 Belize unrest into Greek. I want to submit it for a contest and hopefully win Wikipedia some money. Thanks. Danny 15:54, 23 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Hip hop

Hi. Please don't keep reverting the first line of hip hop music to the line:

Hip hop is a form of rhythmic chanting, often with aggressively hostile content, that is frequently (but inaccurately) referred to as "music."

This isn't an opinion that appears very well informed on either count. Please discuss on the article's Discussion page if you would like to be taken seriously on this article. Tempshill 19:46, 25 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Thanks! Sorry for the misunderstanding. Tempshill 22:07, 25 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Politically incorrect

LOL -- yes, it's frustrating to have to defend Wikipedia from the well-meaning censors as well as the vandals and the spammers, but it's just part of the job. I put Ten Little Niggers on my watchlist after doing some cleanup work on it precisely because I knew that sooner or later someone would want to "fix" the title. Looks like you do good work here -- keep your sense of humor up, your wikistress down, and trust the system; bad things do end up going away over time, and the good things do keep getting better.

Cheers! Your mission, Barbarella, is to find Duran Duran... Catherine\^talk 20:41, 25 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Software development has a 36/48hr cycle?

Hello! Like you I am very much interested in GUIs (have you read the JAVA look and feel guide?) but from the user's point of view since I am trained as a librarian. I have had to resort and depend on a wide variety of software engineers, software developers and software programmers during my career, and this has given me many looks on some fascinating methods of work. There were quite a few individuals or groups with 36 or 48 hour work cycles in coporations, here and there, but even more in university research labs. This has to do with a phenomenon of continuous intellectual flow. When an individual gets in this state of "flow" programming software is much more easier. Getting back to the flow apparently is not easy, hence the reluctance to stop for sleeping, just because it might be "normal" to follow a 24 hourt day. This was described by a scientist whose name I just cannot remember how to spell. It sounds like "chick-sent-me-hailey", pronounced with a Maryland or New Jersey or Pennsylvania US accent. Last time I heard it, it was during a conference by Ben Shneiderman (who you probably know of because of his work on user interfaces) at UIST 2003 in Vancouver. It is not Cszyksendmyali or Cziksendmialyi but it is something close to this. When I can get the correct reference I will write it. --AlainV 02:38, 29 Jan 2005 (UTC)

EFnet #perlhelp, #irchelp

Yeah, that's me, although I don't make my way onto EFnet very much anymore. I guess we've met? — mendel ☎ 01:46, Feb 8, 2005 (UTC)

User Page Vandalism

yeah i know the blanking wasnt done by you... it was done by an anonymous user who was pissed i deleted their link spam from the article on Podcasting. All the same it was quite humorous to load my user page and notice the damn trollwarning banner :) ALKIVAR™ 23:11, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)

History of Greece

Will you PLEASE stop deleting factual information from the History of Greece articles? I KNOW Greek nationalists don't like being told there is a Slav-Macedonian minority in Greek Macedonia, and I KNOW the Greek government denies this (calling them "Slav-speaking Greeks" or something), but the fact is that there is one, and the article should say so. I am SO SICK of having these arguments with petty Balkan nationalists, Greek, Turkish, Bulgarian, Romanian etc etc. What is it with this part of the world? Efharisto. Adam 00:40, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Need Help

The article vanavsos is up for deletion. Can you please help in this regard. Second, I am having difficulty with Wikinfo:Classical definition of republic and am having trouble on Talk:Republic because they won't allow an external link. It was deleted off of Wikipedia, and I believe it needs to come back on. A serious mistake in deleting this article. Thanks for your time.WHEELER 18:30, 8 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Apologies

I am sorry about "Vassilis Leventis" article. Yes, the article was not NPOV. Please also accept my apologies for trolling behaviour. I also restored my talk page as it is appropriate. quantis 12:20, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)

That neat little intro at the top of your talk page

I hope that was a mistake. I was seriously confused when Quantis posted a note intended for you on my talk page, and I couldn't figure out for the life of me how he/she got there.

If it was a joke: don't do that. I don't care, but others might. JRM 10:03, 2005 Mar 16 (UTC)

Image source

Thank you for uploading Image:Ayiwtopoulos.jpg. Its copyright status is unclear, so it may have to be deleted. Please leave a note on the image page about the source of the image. Thank you. --Ellmist 04:56, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC)

NICOS DIMOU SITE

I see that you like his books (so do I). I'm giving you the url for his site http://www.ndimou.gr/index_gr.asp (Newcomer 08:17, 19 Mar 2005 (UTC))

Check it out

We have an unmitigated disaster on our hands. Please check out republic. And I don't know what I am talking about.WHEELER 16:34, 19 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Image

Hi. I don't see how Image:Jambalaya.jpg with no source given falls under fair use. See Wikipedia:Fair use. If you think it qualifies, perhaps you can explainon the image page? Thank you. -- Infrogmation 21:32, 22 Mar 2005 (UTC)

My RFA

Hey wanted to let you know i'm up for Adminship if you want to go vote. Wikipedia:Requests_for_adminship/Alkivar ALKIVAR™ 05:42, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Greek Speaker Tag

I was wondering if you could take a look at the el-2 tag on my user page and check the word choice and grammar for me (I should probably be an el-1.25, but that isn't an option). You can correct the template yourself, or tell me what's wrong and have me do it, and I can apply any neccesary changes to the rest of the templates. Thanks! --Jpbrenna 03:25, 15 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Ok, I changed it, except I used "metria" instead of "mikri." On the el-1 page, I used the same format as the one you've seen, only substituting "vasiki." For el-3, I used "anoteri." What do you think of those choices? On the fluent speaker page (simply "el") I changed it a bit, as you can see here. What do you think?

I was wondering if on e1-e3 I should say "tis ellinikis glossas" or just "sta ellinika?"

Look them over and let me know if you have any suggestions. --Jpbrenna 16:34, 15 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Greece

I have warned the POV pusher on the Greece article that I will block him if he makes another nationalist edit to the article. I don't want to protect the page at the moment as it is only one editor causing a problem, it is easier just to block him if he continues rather stop everyone from editing the page. Rje 18:19, May 4, 2005 (UTC)

Greeks

I agree, really, but I put it there to stand for a photo that wasn't ancient art; a modern photo of Greek people is what I was hoping for, but I've not been able to find anything suitable yet. Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 22:31, 5 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Anything but Evzones or Nana Mouskouri...

The first time I ever visited Greece, we arrived early in the morning, met some friends, were whisked off for a quick shower at the flat we were borrowing in Zografou, a day looking around Athens, the evening at a big PASOK rally (this was in the Summer of 1980), and finally off to a restaurant for something to eat. By this time I hadn't slept for about forty-eight hours, so was nearly dropping off my seat with exhaustion, and I vaguely heard the others discussing what they should eat. I was suddenly brought wide awake when I was sure that I heard them decide to have skilaki... Yes, it was souvlaki, of course — but I was very tired, and I'd never heard the word before (I'm vegetarian). Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 23:12, 5 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

That's a more suitable picture than the "sweaty, overpaid eleven", or however the team was described. I'm amazed that there's no article on Skopelos —, ah, there is... Mel Etitis (Μελ Ετητης) 11:06, 10 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Steve Ballmer

Attempts to communicate with the subjects of Wikipedia are routinely speedy deleted. Rick K 23:45, May 10, 2005 (UTC)

Giati miseis ti xora sou toso poly?

Apo periergia. Miskin

Chess

Hi, I'd just like to let you know that the chess tournament has started. You will play User:Linuxbeak. Look at the rules, decide with your opponent what colour you will play, and then start playing! If you have any questions either ask me or try Wikipedia talk:Chess championship. Good luck! Gkhan 23:58, May 15, 2005 (UTC)

Chess

Just three words, my dear friend.

Bring it on.

Let the best man win >:-D Linuxbeak | Desk 02:03, May 16, 2005 (UTC)

I sure hope nothing bad happened

<Project2501a> something smells like burning plastic in my comptuer...
<Project2501a> in or around.
<FCYTravis> uh
<FCYTravis> that's generally considered not good
<Project2501a> HOLY SHIT
<Project2501a> THE CHIPSET FAN IS ON FIRE
<Project2501a> REBOOTING
<Rdsmith4> oh dear
<FreplySpang> more like unbooting I would guess.
<somebody> more like no computer to boot

Holy shit, that's not good for anyone. Looks like fried Megahertz to me Ghost Freeman | Talk 22:08, 16 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Chess game

Hi

You wrote that you played 4...d6, but is it 4...b6 you meant? That's what you put on the board anyway. Sjakkalle 13:35, 18 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

StarCraft: Ghost edits.

Thanks for the heads up, but I don't understand. Does that mean I should create that template, or put it on that page?

New Stuff

No, I'm not an employee of Blizzard. Right now, I'm not editing the article. That's going to take me until tomorrow. (It's my birthday today and I have a cold.) Are you? If you're not, I should remove that template.

Vote for Deletion

Hi; I'm sorry to be bothering you concerning this, but Wikipedia:Chess championship is up for a VfD. Wikipedia:Votes_for_deletion/Chess_championship Please vote to keep this thing alive... this is so lame that I need to ask people to help out here. Linuxbeak | Desk 03:43, May 19, 2005 (UTC)

John Lee Hooker

Hello! There are several websites that list each musician discography, my favourite one is www.rateyourmusic.com, if you like to search discographies you'll like it, I took that info from there! Good work. :) Afonso Silva 17:39, 21 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Kurdistan Workers Party

Hey man, could you take a look at Kurdistan Workers Party and Talk:Kurdistan Workers Party (probably best to start at the bottom of the talk page and work your way up). - FrancisTyers 09:44, 24 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Btw. subtitrari.images.o2.cz is one of the best subtitle sites I've found on the internet, their interface sucks though ;) - FrancisTyers 09:58, 24 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Race riot

Greetings. Thanks for your note on my talk page. Hope you don't mind, but I find it easier to keep track of discussions if they're in one place. Kindly return to my talk page for my response. Peace 2 u. :) deeceevoice 19:38, 27 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Wikipedian Computer Scientists

Why requiring a BS/BA? And shouldn't it be named Category:Wikipedian computer scientists to keep with the naming convention? --cesarb 23:15, 28 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I say "requiring a BS/BA" because a Computer Scientist is a title awarded by a univerisity/college to a person completing its CompSci degree. how else are you going to be a Computer scientist? as far as the move is conscerned, yeah, you're right, i'll move it right now.

Project2501a

Is it really necessary to be officially recognized by academia to be a computer scientist? Isn't it possible to become one by being an autodidact? Or even, you are still a student, but hasn't graduated yet?

It's like those crazy proposals saying only people with computer science degrees can program a computer or design a network. I hope they never pass.

--cesarb 23:39, 28 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

So, you're telling me that there are persons who, on their own, will study the following topics and be able to excibit considerable knowledge on them:

[snip]

and on top of that, learn 4-5 computer languages, 4-5 computer language paradigms, 5-6 APIs, 2-3 development enviroments and 1 or 2 operating systems.

Dang. I'd like to meet this guy :)

Project2501a

Not impossible. Before entering university, I already knew at least basic computer programming and artificial intelligence; given time (and the right textbooks), it would be easy to learn all the others.

And there's also another two cases:

A student who (like me) hasn't graduated yet.
Someone who studied outside academia (even if following the same curriculum).

Neither of them would have an academic degree.

--cesarb 00:46, 29 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

True. I would place a computer science student under our category, in fact, i'd welcome a student with open arms (cuz they have all the time in the world and can reseach and write articles BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA *Evil laughter*)

Somone outside of academia is not a computer scientist even if he has followed the same curriculum. it's the same deal between mathematicians and amature mathematicians. see Mathematics#Common_misconceptions . Same goes for Computer Science. When was the last time you saw CS theroy being created by an amature computer scientist (person without credentials) and being accepted by the computer world? (academia is the self-refencial pointer by which we can tell if a person has *some* background about his work or not)

Project2501a 00:58, 29 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

So, the category should accept amateur computer scientists too. And it's quite easy to think of someone without any "computer science" credentials who created CS theory: the pioneers of the field, who did it before the credentials could be created (how could they have formal education in a field which didn't even exist yet?). --cesarb 01:06, 29 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The pioneers of the field, where trained mathematicians (which is mostly where computer science originates from) or electrical engineers. Turing, knuth, Dikjstra(sp) were definately not amateurs. Project2501a 01:15, 29 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, but they didn't have a BS/BA in computer science. So, by your definition above, they would be called amateur computer scientists. --cesarb 01:38, 29 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

O grego deixou o edifício no navio do pirata. Project2501a 10:55, 29 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

That made no sense, I'm Brazilian, not Portuguese... --cesarb 11:30, 29 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Some articles for you to look at

I couldn't find much about Psycharis life on the web, and I don't currently have access to a book I know of that had a nice bio section on him. Anything you can add would be appreciated.

In transliterating the names of the ranks, I've tried to stick to the official modern transcription, except where I thought it would help the English reader who wants to learn the names more quickly; for instance, strategos bears a strong resemblance to the English word strategy, and they might not make the connection if I spelt it stratigos.

That last template, Hellenic Army, is based on the British Version. See that nice flag the British have at the top? We need one of those. I downloaded a version of the Hellenic Army symbol: Byzantine double-eagle with cross on its chest from the Bulgarian Wikipedia. However, I can't read Bulgarian and I wasn't sure of its copyright status. I want to get all the military symbols uploaded to Commons, if Greek copyright law allows that. Can you advise me at all on that? (If you're smart, you'll talk to your top sergeant and parlay this into a public relations project for the Greek military and get yourself assigned light duty uploading logos for the rest of your hitch ;) )

Thanks for any help you can give! --Jpbrenna 18:19, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)

P.S. I noticed your recommendation about putting English titles first, then the original Greek. I'm going through the articles and changing that.