Talk:Yassa

Yasa WAS NEVER SECRET OTHERWISE IT COULD NOT HAVE BEEN PROMULGATED AND ITS EXECUTIONS CARRIED OUT WITH ITS TA DO NOT and it was declared in public in Bokhara , modern Uzbekistan by Genghis Khan  is a forty millenary code apparently according to the contemporary chronicle of the history of the Mongols written in Orkhon  Turkish probably under later perhaps Mongke interrogation, it may have flaws, it may be martial law, it may reflect 95% human race species superiority, it forbids lying by death, and this is the same as martial law, but Genghis Khan was saved by a woman lying that there was no-one hidden in her wool cart,he had been hidden under her wool, there were already then genocide orders out against the Mongols, my father Herbert Otto Altar meantime never stops violating me even as a transplantee this too is forbidden by Yasa, Yasa protects the military vehicle and friend the horse, by cutting in half its thief unless he can replace it, there is a suspicion in such case he may have devoured it, he may be allowed to work with his wife and relatives to replace it, or it meant to cut his property in half, but this is not too clear at all, adultery is capital, homosexuality is capital, murder is capital except in war where it is fined with price of an ass or its equivalent in gold, sodomy is capital, witchcraft is capital, sorcery is capital, spying is capital, false witness may replace lies and be capital, desertion is not capital, but punished with forty blows of a stick or stave, it is forbidden to kill animals due to yak thick hide spparently except by the unconsciousness inducing method of reassuring and stilling the heart and ripping oprn the belly,, betrayal was forbidden, could have been capital, peace witih enemy before victory was forbidden, all daughters were to be presented to the Khan, no intercourse is claimed, Mongols were to love one another and forgive sins, it was forbidden to poison wells, or to urinate in water, ashes, or inside tents, whether or not meaning directly on the sensitive floor, by death, it was forbidden to eat from knives or spit back onto plates, by death, the latter possibly after stuffing to vomiting, all religions were respected, and scholars, orphans and invalids of all origins or sides, allowed pension, or tax exemption, 9 offences against Yasa permitted the Khan and his friends,  as also reminded I am by my mother who has knowledge on Yose, the Turkic Yasa, God was permitted to be worshipped in any suitable manner, torture may have been forbidden (re later Mogul code of Jehan), or does it mean as Gonçalvista Jasa-obedient criminals claim World Code, food was commanded to be given from prince to pauper this like love one another and forgive one another offences could be dubious appearing in only two versions, loosing of animals possibly in hunting encirclements was forbidden possibly because of the danger of loosing wolves or snow tigers or Mongolian lions, but only punished with blows of sticks, on the whole beating was forbidden ,  by decree not in Yasa or in Yasa later, all the world was to be brought to the dignity of the steppes, bride trade was forbidden, remarriage of widows and the levirate was permitted, hunting season was decreed, rape was forbidden, decrees for customs alleged, decrees of the raising of the ulus, forbidden to raise objects over others, forbidden by capital penalty to beat dogs with sticks, could be because of wolf crosses, forbidden to wash clothes till worn out that should be it , it used to be sung out one late like storm on a fallen battlefield el haitun ad harat ar bai barlat  bardun khisvi ermer khergen barat baruul and so on just imitating sound, Mongols may have avoided to decapitate their fellow Mongols it is claimed and used bloodless methods, even garotte a Turkic method has been alleged, The Mongols ate blood as holy and containing life instead of pouring it out on the ground as in Judaism    — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.137.204.190 (talk) 22:20, 14 April 2019 (UTC) 

References

Vandalism

Removed two occurrences of vandalism from the page, courtesy user 208.254.22.50. Mmoople (talk) 05:36, 12 September 2008 (UTC) Wham something vandalized the whole Yassa page yesterday I had spent all Sunday correcting it with citations and indeed websites but supposing I know myself from person sources much better, then can I not put on those too? It says to edit Wikipedia in a bold manner but this is not being permitted. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.137.204.190 (talk) 08:33, 15 April 2019 (UTC)

References

What does this even mean?

Taken from the intro: "It is unclear if it was not made secret once generally not followed." — Preceding unsigned comment added by OmgItsTheSmartGuy (talk • contribs) 20:40, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

Controversy

Although this article seems to present this subject as if it were a historical fact, there is far from a consensus on the subject among historians.

"In a series of articles on 'The Great Yasa of Chinggis Khan', professor David Ayalon, reacting to an earlier and under-researched work by A.N. Poliak, demonstrated that Mamluk historians in Egypt were very poorly informed about Mongol Law and that there was no good evidence that Mamluk secular justice was influenced by a Mongol law code which was called the yasa." --"The Mongol Empire and Its Legacy"

(From the same quote) "Dr. Morgan has taken iconoclasm somewhat further and suggested that there is no good evidence to indicate that Chinggis Khan had promulgated a written code of law at the 'quriltai' of 1206 or at any other time--and even if there ever was such a code, we do not know what is in it."

The "Encyclopaedia Iranica" says this under the entry for "YĀSĀ": "a term...frequently used in secondary literature to designate a supposed written code, the “Great Yāsā.” . . . David Ayalon demonstrated that the account of the yāsā furnished by the most frequently quoted author...was derived, not from his supposed informant...but (without acknowledgement) from the encyclopedist Ebn Fażl-Āllāh ʿOmari (d. 749/1349) and through him, ultimately, from ʿAṭā-Malek Jovayni (d. 681/1283, q.v.). Although ʿOmari’s account of the yāsā also incorporated material absent from the extant version of Jovayni’s history and of doubtful provenance, Ayalon showed that Jovayni was virtually our only source on the yāsā (Ayalon, 1971, pp. 101-40), though he still accepted the historicity of a written code.

"David Morgan then demonstrated the lack of evidence for the written code. The account in the Secret History (para. 203; tr. de Rachewiltz, I, pp. 135-36) merely described how Čengiz Khan entrusted his adopted brother, Šigi Qotoqu, with the office of chief judge (yarguči) and the task of maintaining registers of judicial decisions; there was nothing about written laws as such (Morgan, 1986)." Also the general Tocuchar the khan of the sieges as he claimed to be called according to scientific investigations, that is the presiding general of the sieges,

As I understand it, the theory of the Great Yasa is pretty much discredited by this time--although some popular historians appear to be prolonging its existence. In "The Secret History of the Mongols", the word "yasa" is only ever used to refer to individual decrees, never some grand codified set of laws.

Here's part of a good discussion of the subject on reddit.comr/AskHistorians: "Then how do we explain the prevalence of this idea amongst a variety of texts? We're not really sure how the idea started but there are two possibilities. Firstly many of the laws which people claimed formed part of the Great Yasa appear to be part from Mongol customary law, so perhaps the unwritten social customs of the steppe when enforced seemed like part of some grand codified structure. Alternatively it could refer to Genghis Khan's biligs maxims/sayings, which were collected and referred back to. A final possibility is that the idea came from the fact that apparently Mongols would record how certain disputes were settled and then would refer back to this as new situations arose, building up precedent based law. Potentially this could have given the impression of unified set of laws laid down in the misty past." Alex8541 (talk) 05:42, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

please explain how these Mongols coped with no lying?

Contradiction

Was it 'never made public' or 'declared in public in Bukhara'? 87.126.21.225 (talk) 12:34, 2 July 2023 (UTC)